R26 RS250 engine conversion

Discussion in 'Mechanical - Engine, Gearbox, Exhaust etc' started by Chawkie, Oct 23, 2020.

  1. Hmm, I wonder if mine would be capable of similar figures? Only difference would be I'm on 630cc injectors.

    If so, I may keep the 250 turbo for this year and swap it out next winter!
     
  2. Cool...

    I've a DW65C pump anyway so seeing as I have it apart it makes sense to do it.

    We only get 95 fuel here so are limited when it comes to mapping. The new owner of my RS250 had it mapped and it made 275bhp or so with a downpipe and intercooler.

    If I could get somewhere in that region or 300/300 I'd be happy. Its going to get used on Track but also daily driver so can't be too peaky!

    Been referring to all the various threads here today and yesterday. Close to having the R26 engine and box out.

    Off topic for this thread but I assume you removed the power steering pump and left it in the car when pulling the engine. At what stage do you disconnect it? Is there enough play on the PS pipes to pull the engine a small but first and then unbolt it?
     
  3. Cool...

    I've a DW65C pump anyway so seeing as I have it apart it makes sense to do it.

    We only get 95 fuel here so are limited when it comes to mapping. The new owner of my RS250 had it mapped and it made 275bhp or so with a downpipe and intercooler.

    If I could get somewhere in that region or 300/300 I'd be happy. Its going to get used on Track but also daily driver so can't be too peaky!

    Been referring to all the various threads here today and yesterday. Close to having the R26 engine and box out.

    Off topic for this thread but I assume you removed the power steering pump and left it in the car when pulling the engine. At what stage do you disconnect it? Is there enough play on the PS pipes to pull the engine a small but first and then unbolt it?
     
  4. My mates track r26 makes 333bhp/345lbft on 630’s and a 250 turbo, was told it wouldn’t go much higher than that without upgrading the fuelling and turbo.
     
  5. ianplymouth

    ianplymouth RSM Club Member

    The dw65c is a straight swap, my last one i had to cut a bit off, but this one went straight in.

    Not sure what difference running 95 fuel will make than running 99, you could add octane booster, but would be an expensive option i would think.

    Running a 250 turbo won't make it peaky, as its still twin scroll you will be fine.

    Why are you thinking of taking the engine and box out ?????

    Power steering is electric, there is no pump
     
  6. Brilliant, makes sense why I couldn't see it so, the PS pump.

    Engine has low compression, 70psi on cylinder 2.
     
  7. ianplymouth

    ianplymouth RSM Club Member

    Ohhh that's not good, normally it's number 1 cylinder (gearbox end) if you do pull it out and strip the engine, check the valve guides are good, if in doubt change them, done 3 engines now that needed this to be done, including my new one.

    If you are not going to go big power, see if you can find a set of 250/265/275 pistons, or just change the rods.
     
  8. Have an RS250 engine going in, with turbo too hence the questions about the pressure reg in the tank.

    I'll try and pick up a phase 1 pump anyway, seeing as I have everything and the pump is out, makes sense.
     
  9. ianplymouth

    ianplymouth RSM Club Member

    Thats good then, so you have the square fuel rail then ???

    Basically you are going to be doing the same as i did in my 225 project.

    Use the R26 wiring loom, leave the VVt valve in and don't worry about it, swap out the throttle body, i made an adapter, i couldn't get the 250 one to work without issues.

    you have to use the r26 knock sensor as the plugs are different.

    Before you run the engine up, let me know and there are a couple of other bit you need to know.
     
  10. Exactly. Haven't looked too closely at the rail but I assume yes
     
  11. ianplymouth

    ianplymouth RSM Club Member

    is it shiny or black ???
     
  12. I've got the 250 fuel rail and reg ready to go, just need to upgrade the fuel pump and do the relief valve and it should be good for the 250 rising rate fuel system to be mapped in.

    330bhp+ with very little cost from here is tempting as it's a good £2k+ for the big turbo option, although it would be around 100bhp more
     
  13. ianplymouth

    ianplymouth RSM Club Member

    Is it wort the £2k plus for 100hp :confused::confused::confused:

    I'm sure it is, but its not just throwing a turbo on it, its the plumbing, adapters etc etc
    I had an offer of another turbo, the next one up from the one i had in my 265, supposed to be good for 500hp, tempting :openmouth::openmouth::anguished::anguished:
     
  14. Factor in a boost controller to help make it somewhere near close to driveable in the wet too!

    The reality is, 350bhp in one of these is probably the sweet spot.
     
  15. ianplymouth

    ianplymouth RSM Club Member

    I was quite surprised how easy it was to drive around Oulton park in the wet with 388hp and traction control off :sunglasses::sunglasses:

    im sure the R26 will handle the power just as well :laughing::laughing::laughing:
     
  16. Was searching images of fuel pumps today. The reg on the RS250 one looks similar to the R26 one. Did u mention Ian somewhere you're planning a MK3 fuel setup for the r26 and if so have you looked at the possibility the reg from the 250 pump might fit the R26 unit? That's assuming the rs250 one is 5bar
     
  17. ianplymouth

    ianplymouth RSM Club Member

    The reg on the 250 looks like the same as the one fitted to the R26, but after doing some searching the 250 reg's are not available from Renault or elsewhere, seems a bit expensive to buy a 250 tank unit just for the FPR valve, the internals are slightly different as the DW65c pump wasn't a straight fit.

    The mk3 fuel set up i'm going with is the fuel rail, injectors and the FPR valve in the tank, as i can then run the raising rate fuel system.

    The one in the 250 is actually 5.5bar
     
  18. I've decided to go 630cc Injectors!

    My assumption is I go for 630s for an RS250 and not for a 225, correct.

    They've different part numbers
     
  19. @ianplymouth , Hoping for another steer please!!

    Im starting the car with the R26 injectors in place to make sure all is together ok and before I take it down for mapping.

    For initial start, I assume I need to block the FPR at the rail until the mapper is tuning in the rising rate fuel pressure.

    Do I simply cap the intake manifold port and block the pipe into the FPR for now?
     

    Attached Files:

  20. ianplymouth

    ianplymouth RSM Club Member

    Hi Chawkie

    First you need to remove the fuel pressure relief valve, then you need to remove the small "O" ring on the tip, keep it safe as you will need to put it back in at the mappers.

    If you put the pipe back on the manifold and take it off of the FPR valve, then block the open end with a small screw, you need this in as it will allow air into the induction and give you a weak mixture and possibly cause issue, there is no need to block the FPR valve pipe it will do nothing at this point.

    Leave it like this until you are at the mappers, then refit the small "O" ring, the pipe and the injectors your using.
     
    Chawkie likes this.
  21. Thanks Ian.

    I'll take some pics for future reference of the o ring.

    Question on the injectors. I've a set of 630s going in and these are advertised as suitable for the MK2 and MK3 engine but the MK3 is much longer so injecting the fuel at a different spot in the combustion chamber.

    Is there a long 630 injector more like the MK3, middle of the pic attached
     

    Attached Files:

  22. ianplymouth

    ianplymouth RSM Club Member

    The injector fitting needs to be left till you get to the mappers.

    You are right the Mk3 injectors have a long nozzle, but fitting the 630's will work as they have done on hundreds of Mk3's before, it just fires the fuel into the intake port so it doesn't have an effect on the performance, the long 630 injectors have a longer body so they will not fit.

    Don't throw the Mk3 injectors away, there great for an R26 or 225 running around 310hp and still wont be at 100%
     
  23. Yes, figured that about keeping them there untill mapper starts dialling it in.

    O ring removed, mind helping me understand what removing it does for now?
     

    Attached Files:

  24.  

    Attached Files:

  25. ianplymouth

    ianplymouth RSM Club Member

    I presume you have done the pump in the fuel tank and added a 5bar regulator ?????

    what it does is hold the fuel pressure at 3.5bar
     
  26. Yes done the intank part.

    Looking at the rail FPR with the o ring removed, does it mean it's taking a read of atmospheric pressure or does it effectively disable it?

    To me, it looks like it'll create a vacuum leak?

    No questioning, keen to understand it a little more
     
  27. ianplymouth

    ianplymouth RSM Club Member

    its open to atmospheric pressure, until the pipe gets connected at the mappers, you don't want 5 bar solid pressure at the injectors at idle or any rpm and boost level.
    Removing the "O" ring holds the fuel pressure at 3.5bar the same as a standard fuel system.
     
    Chawkie likes this.
  28. @ianplymouth i think you need to just write a parts list and what to do with them and then get admin to stick it as a tread :smile:
     
    ianplymouth likes this.
  29. ianplymouth

    ianplymouth RSM Club Member

    I think i did all this years ago on my 225, i think its in my "225 gets a 250 engine" or something like that :laughing::laughing:
     
  30. ianplymouth

    ianplymouth RSM Club Member

    Got a new project inbound, but not saying too much at the moment :laughing::laughing:
     
  31. Yes that’s true but it’s full of chit chat. Just a straightforward to do list

    still got my r26 and still want more power and still don’t want to spend thousands on it
     
  32. Will run fine with the o ring fitted before mapping, I checked afr's and mine was fine with the 5 bar reg fitted in tank before mapping. Just leave the vac pipe off and bunged, and a steady drive to the tuner.
     
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