Gearbox Whine 275 Cup-S

Be interesting to hear if you feel any difference, i don't know if you will feel it but all i know it let me drive mine back from the Ring without killing the rest of the gearbox before i got home.

 

This isn't the diff bearing, but you can see the wear

2020-05-10_10-31-00 by Ian Austin, on Flickr

 

and this was the bearing, there were no abnormal noises either

2020-05-10_10-29-32 by Ian Austin, on Flickr

 

So what did you do - replace the bearing? if so, where did you source a new one from?

 

I bought another gearbox from Ebay and was in the process of rebuilding the one i took out, but now have sold the car.

I still have the gearbox, i bought all the bearings (and some oil seal)s from a local bearing supplier

 

So i got also this gearbox whine while driving and ticking noise when driving very slow on my 275. I left the car at my local Renault service garage becouse i was 100% that i got this gearbox or diff bearings problem. Today is almost 2 months and half and car is still at the Renault garage. They said bearings have some little traces of use but they are not destroyed. They took apart gearbox and diff and inside is all like brand new, also oil is like a new, no damage anywhere. They put together gearbox and still got a whine and ticking noise and they cant find the reason. Car have 40 000 km, like brand new, never any problems with it. They contacted main dealership in my country and they just said replace gearbox with new which can cost me about 4000-5000 eur which is insane.
So why are gearbox and diff bearings such a problem on this car and why they get damaged? So if they replace bearings they can again get damaged after let say 40 000 km? Where is the reason behind this?
What can i do, i dont want replace my gearbox with a brand new becouse is not broken?

 

The issue is more than likely that Renault changed the bearing design or material in the later 275 models, that’s why you don’t see the issue in the earlier 250/265 cars very much.

I assume you’re not in the UK ? Most of the local specialists around here have seen plenty of these boxes (A similar box is used on some of Renaults vans) As most of us with the issue have just had the bearings replaced, it cost me about £600 for everything (Removal, fixing, refit, oils etc) on my old 275.

 

Yes I am not from Uk. 275 are pretty rare in my country and I am probably only with this problem.

 

Hello everyone.
Just to add my 2 cents to symptoms:
For quite some time very hardly noticeable whining when decelerating (engine braking). Lately slightly louder whine when doing more than 30mph (50kmh), noise correlates with speed (doesn't matter if it is in gear or not, if clutch is engaged, or not).
At very low speeds ~ 5km/h when in NEUTRAL (!) slow clicking noise again correlates with speed. I am not sure, if this is also related to diff bearing, but i guess it could be.

I've read a lot of discussions in here about gearbox and for me it is well known weakness of these cars for a long time.
But what caught me off guard is that multiple people mentioned newer versions have even worse diff bearings.

So if i want to replace them, should i order original ones, or is there any aftermarket up-rated solution?

 

I have a 275 cup S which had the typical gearbox/diff whine symptoms was rebuilt by a Renault specialist with a brand new bearing set and unfortunately the noise still persists albeit at slightly different speeds frequencies.

Incredibly frustrating as it’s not exactly a cheap job, the specialist very kindly took the box apart again to check everything over and it all look like new (as it should).

Having spoken to other specialists/owners it seems even despite having new bearings the tolerances inside the box may be out slightly and enough to cause the noise (whine) that is present. I assume this can be corrected by shimming the bearings etc by a gearbox specialist but I imagine most just fit as is.

 

Transmissions will generate a level of noise to some extent. I wouldn't be too concerned unless you notice an increase in noise etc. There will likely be a noise when moving between acel/decel.

The tolerances from build can be checked if required. But the manual states that re-shimming is only required if you change specific items (I forget off the top of my head) that would alter the distance between bearings on the assembled shaft.

The casing wouldn't be the easiest thing to measure without the right tools but I'm sure a trans specialist will have the kit to do it. The manual I read provided instructions for re-shimning.

I fitted a full set of SNR bearings to mine and altered no dimensions. One tolerance was +0.05mm but I carried on with it anyway. Covered 3k miles plus and all is fine.

 

Find that strange tbh, when I had mine done on my old 275 there was no noise after and it was like brand new.

I mean I have no idea about gearboxes, bearings etc (only from when I had the issues with mine) but when the specialist has had the box back apart, why didn't they rectify the issue by shimming the bearings (if this is a way of fixing it)

I know how much I paid for mine doing and I'd be well annoyed if the noise that was there before, was still there. Apart form it being annoying the noise didn't cause any drivability issues so might have well have left it and saved the money.

 

I can’t quite get my head around it I must admit but the whine before refurb was predominantly off throttle in 3rd and 4th gear and after refurb it is very much the same albeit slightly less evident. Happy to live with it but it’s still in the back of my mind things will get worse, something has to be making the noise it’s not like they are like that from new.

 

Very annoying! The specialist outsources the box and has confirmed all bearings were replaced and as I say he took the box apart again himself for free so can’t ask for much more.

Feel like a particular bearing could have been missed or the tolerance in the box/particular shaft is out enough to cause an issue.

 

Btw do you guys occasionally get a shiny selecting 1st gear when stationary? Pretty sure this was apparent before the box was refurbed and people suggest it’s normal.

 

@Sam Bennett , Did the gearbox repairer report on the condition of the bearings removed . A noisy bearing would show obvious signs of wear .

My '14 265 had slight bearing whine before the 60k mile mark. I removed and stripped the box to find the short 3rd/4th mainshaft had surface pitting on the bearing races . I did a complete bearing replacement but noticed when refitting the case both mainshafts were very tight when it was all bolted up . I bought a set of genuine shims to adjust the clearance but even at the thinest shim both shafts were tight to turn , IIRC it took another .15mm or so off to get were the shafts would spin nicely . Bare in mind this is down to my experience working as a mechanic that I used to gauge the feel of it , also the replacement SNR bearings may have had a slight deviation in thickness too . From talking to others , it seems to be known these boxes (also the pk6 in the traffic/master vans) are setup too tight from the factory leading to premature bearing fatigue .

 

Very interesting and informative Thankyou for your reply! I wasn’t aware one of the reasons for bearing failure from new was due to the bearings being tight which makes perfect sense.

All I got back from the fitter was that the bearings didn’t look too bad although before reconditioning the box I changed the fluid and sediment/metal was evident. Once the gearbox fluid was changed strangely the whine got worse.

Sounds like I need to get the box back out again and check the tolerances and shim accordingly.

When you say took 0.15mm off the shaft do you mean you had material removed/machined?

 

Judging by what you mentioned it sounds like bearing wear in the box , especially metal in the fluid but would have been good to get confirmation from the repairer of what they found exactly .

The material was removed from the mainshaft shims that sit behind the bearing races in the end/top casing . I made a holder for the shim that allowed me to gently sand it down to the thickness that I felt let the mainshafts spin with the appropriate amount of force . The mainshafts can be placed by themselves with the case tightened and spun by using the input shaft installed with them or just by themselves using a long flat head screwdriver ( use tape on the top to protect the shaft ) through the driveshaft holes .

If I were in your position Sam , I wouldn't do anything just yet and see how it progresses .

 

Thanks for the advice, appreciate it! I am confident it’s had a new bearing set fitted so the noise has to be related to the tight tolerances you mention or an incorrect shim stack fitted. I am just concerned as you rightly suggest that if the shafts are too tight then this will cause premature wear on the new bearings.

Like you say I am probably better to suck it and see at this stage and if it gets worse strip it down again. The whine certainly isn’t as bad as it was before although I am now using redline MTF rather than elf nfp that was in the box before which could be quieting things down.