Morning all! So yesterday I did my first ever track day in the Megane. And I have to say, I loved the car beforehand, but now...my god this thing is a weapon! And just for info, it's a bone stock 250 FF, just with a Cup gearbox fitted. So room for improvement when my talent measures up. I took it to Blyton Park and I was amazed how different it reacted to on the road. Obviously there were some major factors influencing this (not least much higher corner entry speeds on the track) but on the road, the back always feels loose and like it's going to swap ends. It even felt like that on the slow sighting lap. But, once I'd remembered my racing days and started taking better lines and settling the car before each bend, the back felt utterly planted. Only 3 times did it step out of line and 2 of those were me provoking it! Towards the end of the day, I found myself wanting the back to move more to rotate the car into the apex more, especially on the mid/low speed corners like Jochen and Bunga-Bunga. Even with the diff, it was pushing on under a balanced throttle. Now this could well be down to driving style, but I just felt like the front needed something more. Maybe I could have come in a little hotter on the brakes to provoke it? Maybe it was pressures as I was running 2.6-7 hot on the front right (it's a left hand circuit) and 2.3 rear. For info I'm running Eagle F1 ASY2's all round and a picture is attached for those that care to appraise it! What's worth noting is that although the wear seemed even across the tyre, the wear across the 3 center blocks was not. I mean where you can see the wear bar in the middle of the picture, the depth was maybe 2mm, but on the opposite edge of the same block, it was maybe 3mm. So my questions are this: Would adjusting the front pressures have helped? Or do I have an imbalance between front and rear pressures, inviting understeer? Should I just be braver and provoke that back end more? On an otherwise stock car that is a daily driver, might some Silver Project (or similar) top mounts be a wise investment or not? But, all in all, I absolutely love this car and it's going to be far faster than I have talent for, at least in the foreseeable future. Oh and now I'm off to the For Sale section to look for track day wheels Thanks! Nath.
Apart from the wrong pressures (2.4 -2.5 max when hot), your tyres are totaly unappropriate for track use and abuse generally. After 2 laps , they are falling apart. Thats why you had understeer. You need the proper tyres
If the middle had worn they were over inflated. More camber is never a bad thing either, it was the first thing I said it needed when I bought mine
Hey Steering, Yep, point taken and I failed to add that I only did the track day on these tyres as I was close to replacing them as a set, so thought "Why not" I was going to start a new thread (or heaven forbid...use the search function!) asking what tyres might be best for a daily driver that might get 4-5 track days a year. As for pressures, you are right about the pressures, they started at around 2.0 cold, I gave them a few laps to get up to 2.2 or so before loading them up laterally but they did go off after about 2.5. *edit* Thanks Jamie, makes sense both about the pressure and camber. Oh and sorry, I forgot to reply to your PM
Hi Nathan, I'm in a similar situation to you having just got my 250 cup - i'm sure you've seen the threads I started but if not they may be of use Share your thoughts about how great it is, glad you're enjoying it! I found I needed to run higher pressures to stop the fronts from rolling over. My tyres looked like your picture, I'm no expert but I'm hoping negative camber will solve this. Not sure about an imbalance in pressure, looks ok to me.. You could always try getting some cup suspension to liven it up on track although it won't be as nice to use daily. Can imagine using camber plates will have a detrimental affect on ride although maybe Jamie could share his experience more? You probably know running -camber will wear the tyres very quickly on road, I'm not sure how easy it is to adjust either. Cheers Sam
Excesive negative camber (above 1,5deg) is not good for the road and braking. It increases torque steer too..... High castor angle (which the car has) helps a lot when cornening (acting as camber). The only thing you need is appropriate tyres and pads.
In the slow corners try a little trail off the brakes. I don't know about the mk3 but in my R26 this gets the back end moving nicely to kill the understeer, alternatively I find in my R26 that just turning in late and aggressively with the steering gets the car slightly loose in a helpful way, depending on the corner I will pick which option to use.
I agree with NJH! As for tyres, get Michelin pilot Supersport! Verstuurd vanaf mijn XT1635-02 met Tapatalk
I think based on the advice received here and from friends etc, the next step is indeed a decent set of tyres. Ideally I'd like just like the one set that will do both daily and track. I know that two dedicated sets is bound to be better, but considering that if I get 4 track days a year in I'll be lucky, I'm thinking (hoping!) that a one set of AD08R's on my current 18in rims might be a wise investment, then see how they do on another track day. With decent pressures of course. Down the line if I find myself able to get a few more days in then maybe a set of pure track wheels/tyres might be in order. As for pads, I've still got a decent set of stock pads in there and they did a cracking job on the day. Sure, something uprated would do better, but I'm probably due new disks when these pads wear out so I'll do the job lot then. I read good things about CL 5+ for balanced use? Thanks again all, Nath.
Almost forgot, with the mention of Cup suspension, am I right in thinking that it consists of thicker ARB's front and rear, stiffer springs but the same dampers? Or are the dampers different too? And would there be any point swapping out say just the ARB's or does it really need the lot to not bugger up the handling? Nath
If you're looking for tyres there's a guy selling AD08R's ridiculously cheaply on ebay: £360 for a set of 4 in 235/40/18, £420 for a set of 4 in 235/35/19. If you want a set at that price message this seller and ask if he would match the prices he's done for me (Sam). http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/191977037214?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT
Brilliant, might just do that! Daft question time again though, but shouldn't I be going for 225/40/18s?
I'm not sure it'll make much difference but I think stock size is 235/40/18. That guy has the 225's as well but if you go for them they should be a little cheaper than the 235's. These tyres will will worsen the ride just fyi, will feel more crashy over bumps.
I think that might be the same guy I got mine from but I was dealing with him outaide of eBay, I've bought 4 pairs off him this year and they all arrived quickly and were dated recently so not old stock.
As above, I dealt with a chap outside eBay and I think it's the same seller. Bought a set for my Megane and also a set for my brothers VXR. All arrived within two days and the dates where all excellent and as recent as any local tyre shop. I've just been to Spa and the AD08r are a superb tyre for a mixture of road and track use. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
AD08R's are on my list now Just need to read the other threads and decide on 225 or 235s. Does seem weird that the Cup came with bigger tyres on the same rims, with no gearing changes though.
Sadly I don't think the AD08Rs come in high enough load rating so are not insurance proof. Not a prob on track of course but if you need to get there on the same tyre or run them daily then that's an issue.
This I was unaware of! But I do recall reading something about load and insurance now you come to mention it. In fact, it may well have been in another of your threads. I shall go do some research. Maybe Michelin PSS's are the way to go instead. Or as so many have suggested, dedicated track wheels, but I'm really trying to avoid that due to various reasons, storage being one of them. One set that can cope OK with, but not excel at both road and track would be ideal. Nath.
BRIDGESTONE S001, YOKO V105, VREDESTEIN VORTI Road tyres with stiff sidewalls. Could cope with more than 2 laps on track...
I am the bearer of bad news !!! Supersport are no better than any other road tyres on track. Due to very soft sidewalls the front outer shoulders get chewed very quickly. Yoki 105s are not quite as bad in that respect but you may want to consider Nankang NS2Rs.
Supersports are getting replaced by the Pilot Sport 4 S anyway, Lets hope they have stiffened up the sidewalls as they truly et the SS down
That's a very good point and not something I've considered (having just bought a set of AD08R's in 19's!) Any idea what this load rating is supposed to be?
I've just ordered some Yokohama A048s at a bargain price. They've got a couple of sets left if anyone is after a set. £560 delivered. 01363775361
