Right, I have my car booked in at RS tuning next month and I'm wondering what bhp my car will achieve, Its a R26 and will have an GPI intercooler, induction kit and an a back box chop, It will have the uprated injectors fitted and mapped at RS, I have considered a decat but the pain at MOT time has put me off, Any ideas?
I actually think it may be lower. The amount of power that a decat unlocks can be quite a lot. With that in mind I'm thinking around the 265 mark with torque around the 270ft lbs region.
If your on a standard turbo and a standard exhaust as above probably around 280ish bhp. The torque will be wound back/ limited as you can easily go over 300lbs/ft. 265bhpish is a strong stage 1 so I would expect more than that tbh! Sent from my HTC Desire EYE using Tapatalk
You should see more than 265, mine made roughly that amount on a stage 1 with just a modded airbox and panel filter, otherwise it was completely standard at the time.
I was there last Friday and the car was 236bhp / 236ft/lb as standard. The car has 3" turbo-back decat, chopped airbox and airtec IC. It was mapped to the limit of the rods, so 300ft/lb, and made 280bhp with 630cc injectors.
Like night and day. The car was much smoother and felt far more refined on the long journey home on the M1, but pulled like a train with the extra torque when needed
Mine made a disappointing 270/300 with sports cat, milltek, cooler, 630 Was hoping for 280+ so was a bit frustrating, could be down to the sports cat over decat
I haven't even got a sports cat, Decat makes a difference, just can't be bothered with finding a 'friendly' MOT tester
If your engine is healthy it should make 270+HP Mine made 265hp/285lb/ft 5 years ago with no mods and a weak injector. Car has never missed a beat since. Utter transformation in power delivery,with standard map useablity. Rs tuning has always been the place to go. Why get frustrasted over 10 bhp/lbft??..you will never notice it. With a shortshift,excellent tyes,top quality brake fluid/ pads and a strong stage 1,the R26 is a match for anything on a twisty road.
Do you need the 630 injectors? I'm going to see rstuning in August for remap, I've got original injectors in at the moment.
I was going to get new injectors anyway, my car came with little history and the mechanic I used suggested I may need a change so I may aswell pay the extra for the 630cc
The more I read this thread the more I think that these power figures are more down to healthy engines rather than what modifications people have done to them. For example when I went for mine last year it made 280/300 on standard injectors which were showing 69k miles on them with no history of having them changed!!! You may find an engine with all the relevant modifications may well make less than a high miler with only a couple on it. It really does seem like a bit of a toss up. Sports cat over decat. Decat over sports cat. Which is better ultimately comes down to how well the engine has been looked after in the past or how well the exhaust flows or so it seems. It may also be affected by the weather on the day of the run! Humid, dry, raining etc. It was raining when I had mine mapped! I had no dealings with these cars and engines until I bought one 4 years ago and started playing with them. Rest assured that once you have had this initial remap you will be overjoyed at the difference it makes despite what figures it makes. The feeling is superb and you will be itching for more in the future.
From past experience especially with my MK1 FRS, it could also be down to the condition of the actuator
Anything I need to check before I make the trip up? Apart from oil etc, I'm going to change my spark plugs just the be safe
I had a faulty actuator a forge one, did not hold boost. Car was not pushing over 256. Paul changed it for a stock actuator and it went up to 282. Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk
I'm relatively new to the Renault tuning scene, but am experienced with mods/tuning, and it always comes down to bottlenecks. It appears that decat, injectors etc are simply not bottlenecks up to 280bhp / 300ftlb, where it's the rods that are limiting the ability to push for more power. If you had the internals done and push the turbo to its limits, then maybe fit a bigger turbo, you'd soon find the 3" decat and 630cc injectors come into play, because the standard kit would be the next bottleneck.
Apart from the chocolate rods, I think the exhaust, turbo and standard injectors are major bottlenecks. The standard injectors are already almost maxed out at stage 1, from memory there at or over 100% duty at some parts of the rev range. Larger injectors will get you an easy 10bhp mid-range as they can supply the correct amount of fuel needed - with a safety margin. The standard exhaust can flow just under 300hp - but this is with major major boost. I vaguely remember a thread on the old site that had a hybrid pushing over 1.4 bar of boost and couldn't make more than 291bhp. They changed the exhaust and turned the boost down (approximately 1 bar) and made much more power! Sent from my HTC Desire EYE using Tapatalk
Of forgot to add the standard turbo is running out of puff around 280/290 if your very lucky! You can have a shit load more mid range torque but the rods can't take it! Sent from my HTC Desire EYE using Tapatalk
Mine made 290hp and pulled the torque back to 290lb/ft to keep it 'safe' mods are RsTuning 3" decat, ktec 3" exhaust, FMIC, Itg intake, 630 injectors, hard Pipe kit. When it did the power run before mapping it made 240hp and Paul said injectors would be needed. If you plan on more engine mods then I'd bite the bullet and go for injectors and it will prevent high duty cycle on your current ones. Regards KT
I do plan future mods but not for a while, I want to keep it safe as just from reading the forum the rods seem to not like torque near 300lbft, I was planning to purchase new injectors anyway so I may aswell pay a bit extra for the 630cc's to plan for future mods.
It's pot luck with the rods, my first engine bent a rod on a simple stage 1 at around 50K miles so probably around 260lbs/ft Sent from my HTC Desire EYE using Tapatalk
I don't have an R26. I'm running the black oil version of the car. I do have extensive knowledge of vehicle modification especially four cylinder turbos and have taken stock 2.0Turbo Saab engines from 150bhp to over 400. Obviously at 400 it's had lots of mechanical changes. Leaving the engine stock and literally just mapping 250bhp could be achieved before 630cc injectors (Siemens) were needed. Even a stock 2.5" exhaust and standard IC yielded those values. The IC would saturate and power would drop so a large high capacity IC is needed. In terms of exhaust, a decat and 3" down pipe is critical to high gas velocity whilst still maintaining high exhaust gas temps. After the down pipe as long as 2.5" remained in place it didn't much else matter (assuming you've not got a crappy pattern system). I noticed lots of variation in output from car to car with similar mods. The main cause of this was down to the condition of several things: - integrity of vacuum lines and pipe work feeding the engine. Inter cooler and delivery hoses can leak as can gaskets and air metering junctions. Any loss in pressure will cause a drop in figure. - weak dumpvalve spring or diaphragm - weak turbo actuator capsules or defective boost solenoid control valves made a big difference. - ignition system condition. Saab used a Direct Ignition cartridge. You could run a car and pull repeatable and respectable values without any faults showing. Swap out the DI and get a much improved/reduced value, again without system faults. - spark plug type and condition - faulty or slow MAP sensors - faulty or slow MAF/AMM sensors - slightly damaged compressor blades reducing the amount of peak charge flow for a given boost pressure - weak or low flow Fuel Pressure Regulators - weak fuel pump - fuel grade - air con on/air con off All these things are applicable to any turbo charged car and really a baseline condition should be established before tuning commences. If it doesn't make much power after the remap your stuck asking lots of questions. If you test it first you know straight away the system is compromised in some way and that will tell you your car won't make healthy upgrade power. Investigations should be carried out and anything rectified before remaps take place because otherwise you'll fill in a problem by pushing more power through but not get the full potential. Compression tests are a good idea and quick to do. Or use something like Pico scope to do a power balance (detects alternator output after shutting down certain cylinders. If electrical charging reduces this shows a weak cylinder). Rolling roads take account of pressure and temperature and will "correct" the measures torque value and calculated horsepower value. Standard atmospheric is 1013.5mb. Sometimes you will see someone's print out and it says "850mb", 32 deg C etc. In such a case the dyno software will make a calculation and adjustment to modify the measured values up. In such an instance chances are the rolling road operator has manually entered this in order to give a more pleasing value for the customer. All rolling roads read the torque at the wheels and then measure the drag on wind down, make a calculation of the losses and then add it on to get a guesstimated crank power. All rolling roads vary and like any measuring device require calibration. Some over read, some under read. I operated a Maha 2000 as part of a training facility eight years ago. Our test car was a LHD Jag x- type 2.0 V6. We tested other cars on it including our own and use to setup low level race cars but it was consistent. We'd never worry about other values from other operators as you can only compare like with like. I guess most of you have used RS so assuming he's not changed his setup your comparisons still stand and reflect the condition of your engine as noted above.
Out of interest what sort of boost is getting you 280-290 lbft and 280bhp? I'm guessing 1.5 Bar on that lump? RS 175 Lux
Just get it up to paul at RS Tuning,and let him guide you.NO ONE has more Meganesprt knowledge than him. He bought the original 225 way back to develop the mapping for them..so he had many years of testing to make sure his maps are the best. A quick call to him will be all you need for starters before you take the car up. As others have said..a lot of this is down to the condition of your own personal engine. If you up the power,you pay the money and take your chance..
