Evening/morning all, Had an interesting experience today, got a call early in the morning to drive over to Hinkley for a dyno day, why not? Got my 275 sportnav on the dyno, (1900 miles) completely standard, sport mode, V Power Nitro+, it made 255bhp on the first run and 246bhp on the second?!?! Now I know there are many variables, Maybe the dyno wasn't 100% calibrated amongst many other things, I have also read on here about the software update on EU6 engines, my car was registered in June so I do require this update. Sometimes it seems much faster than others, and does occasionally hesitate initially on hard throttle. I have put that down to the over-sensitive knock sensor software. But STILL! Very disappointing? I will run it again after the update and see what happens, Has anyone else tested theirs? Have I got a Friday afternoon car?!
I wouldn't get too upset by that, The torque is pretty much spot on for what it should be. Interesting to see what difference the updated software makes though
Yes with ESC off, it's the only mode you can dyno it in as the front wheels turning on their own would confuse the ESC system
Since the torque is spot on I guess it's because of the knock sensor before the update my torque was spot on as well on the RS monitor.. Verstuurd vanaf mijn XT1635-02 met Tapatalk
Thanks for this info, will be very useful when trying to explain my plea to Renault, who currently really don't want to help me! I have the latest clip software, and will be buying a pass-through device hopefully I can add R.S monitor myself as they have said today they won't do it, Thanks again
The guy said it was at the flywheel mate, usually there is a 15% difference (Roughly) so if the 246bhp run was at the wheels it would work out at 295bhp, which wouldn't be right so I'm sure it's flywheel horsepower on the print out
If the torque is there then the power is there surely as power = torque x revs. I might have missed something though.
Well yes you have, that formula needs dividing by 5250 (converts RPM to radians per second as its an angular motion situation) [emoji14] But yeah I was thinking exactly the same thing. If the torque is factory perfect across the engine speed range then so should the power. Not knowing what you guys mean by the "torque is right" it's difficult to say exactly but if the torque figure is the right value at the peek power rpm point then the power should be correct also. If you mean the torque is being produced at some other point it doesn't necessarily correlate that it will make the right power. I suspect peek torque is produced much lower than peek power. You really need to know what the torque should be doing in the last 1000-1500 rpm before you hit peek power. I suspect you'll find at this point the torque is down on what it should be. Lack of torque will be as a direct result of lack of boost. Sounds like the ECU is holding back for some reason.
Peak power on mine was roughly 5650rpm @ ~248ft/lbs stock, I can't read the graph but from the figures it looks like it's essentially saying peak power is at 6008 RPM @ 255hp giving 222ft/lbs? Peak torque is about right but that seems very low higher up in the range, 20lb/ft down (can mines a 250 too). Like L-1011 says, it sounds like like it's holding back or being starved.
Morning Lads ive got a 275 cup s. Registered 23rd November 2015 Anyway after a few months I found the car to idle lumpy and contacted Paul at RS Tunning Leeds as he has worked on my previous Rs,s, He said on my model I need an update I'm assuming its the same software update your talking about in the previous posts. I took my car back to my dealer and asked them for an update and they said my car does not need one and seemed very docile and confused about me even asking for an update? My car still has idling issues and feels lumpy at times? So does my car need an update? Cheers
Just a quick one ive spent some time reading and getting more info on my ecu etc! Ive not experienced loss of power and ive done a few days in mine. Some times when I'm at lights for a period of time when I pull away there is no turbo pressure for a few seconds. That's the only issue I can feel with the car and also the idling lumpy at lights too.
Right so using those values, (222x6008)/5250=254BHP (248x5650)/5250= 267BHP Now if you want 275BHP @ say 6000RPM then you just reverse the calculation: (275x 5250)/6000= 240 So you should be producing 240lbsft at 6000RPM to hit your 275 mark. What is the exact book figure for peek power and at what RPM? RS 175 Lux
Hi L-1011, This is correct, Peak power should be 271bhp at 5,500rpm, torque is supposedly 266lbft at 3000rpm, although my car showed 292lbft at 3004rpm. Strange? Either way I will be getting the update done I will force Renault if I have to! I have checked my version with Clip and it definitely needs doing. Great to have a forum where people help rather than argue about which car is best etc! We all know which is best already Jd-Jd, your car must have the earlier software, Renault also said to me my car doesn't need to have an update, but I explained it was impossible for them to know that as they won't know until they ID the ecu software version that is currently on my car! Like talking to a brick wall, I guess they don't like to be told what is what by another mechanic. Car is due to go in next Tuesday so I will put it on the dyno again after and post the results!
If it's meant to be 271BHP at 5500rpm then you should be getting 259lbft also at 5500rpm. So yours is down on torque. This will be because it's down on boost at this point. Conversely if you are meant to produce 266lbft at 3000 rpm then you should be making 152bhp at that point. The fact your car makes more torque earlier and then starts to fall off earlier tells me it's probably over boosting mid range and is being pulled back to stop engine knock and hence causing it be underpowered further up. Your two runs kind of confirm this as your peek torque is similar back to back but it's achieved 500rpm lower down on the second run (faster rising rate boost pressure) but the result of that is your peek BHP is less as the ECU has suddenly pulled off boost. How long was it between runs? If it was back to back the IC would be saturated which would have left hotter less dense air for the engine to deal with I suppose. It could be a mapping issue or something physical that controls boost is faulty. It's a shame you didn't get chance to swap out the boost solenoid valve whilst you were on the rollers. You'd be amazed at the variation of response to ECU commands from one valve to another. As you know it's the solenoid valve that controls boost pressure off the ECU signal. I'd also be checking all the vacuum lines. You'll have done all this already though as you guys are workshop. I'm guessing your turbo is VNT? RS 175 Lux
Absolutely right, it's pretty much down all the way across the board, apart from the 'torque spike' if you can call it that, the runs were done within 2 minutes of each other. I also thought this was a telltale sign of the issues people have been experiencing on track due to the software, they have reported power loss after a few minutes of hard driving. Pistonhead members were quick to criticise the car that it couldn't maintain full power for long periods of hard driving, but we now know this is the knock sensor software causing this. The update seems to have solved it in these cases. I will re-iterate it cannot be due to the fuel, it has only ever had V-Power in it. I would've expected run 2 to be slightly worse due to temps etc, but it seems to be an excessive loss, and especially with the torque coming in earlier on run 2 and the timing/boost retardation after that, this definitely highlights an issue with the car. You could be right regarding the turbo solenoid/vacuum system, I haven't checked yet but I will do if it still isn't right after the update. I just find this very interesting as a passionate Renault specialist with a 1800 mile car straight out of the box! I'm definitely not the only person with an EU6 275 engine experiencing this problem! As I said on my first post on this thread it does also hesitate initially sometimes when I dump the throttle, it isn't the ESC interfering as It still does this even with everything turned off! Im sure it is another symptom of the over-sensitive knock sensor!
If this was an old car I'd be looking at the ignition system with all the symptoms you've described. After that fuelling. It's probably just as you suspect, ECU map! RS 175 Lux
