265 So I assume I need braided hoses?

Yes less time for pad/disc contact with late braking but the energy values transferred over a shorter duration leading to higher peak temp values. This is the point you seem to be ignoring. Also remember, on circuit, this is a rapid and repeated process with late braking.

We we will obviously have to disagree, but you will find it impossible to convince race teams (at all levels) that data log and run real time the brake performance data that if you have a critical brake temp issue on circuit you need to brake later and harder. They all do completely the opposite to control the temp delta. That's why I'm sorry to say your theory, whilst interesting, isn't applicable in this real world scenario.

Good to chat though and maybe it's time for some more 'quality' inputs from the other recent posters.

 

In my world,running 343 disks,DS 1.11 pads,steel lines, and on track,brake late/hard, then off brake. I don't tend to linger on the brakes. Never had a problem with this set up. My secret is I probably don't drive fast enough to create heat!.

 

don't bother with braided lines, not needed :cool:

 

Best way to do it.

Of course I'm also sure if your start to get a bit of brake fade or fluid fade you would push harder and brake later to sort the temp problem and get the system cooled

 

or come into the pits and let it cool down for a bit

 

LOL Deja Vu:

Reply:

 

have a read back yourself fella, the op said it was about a soft pedal LOL, i was also being facetious about the brake lines, everyone i know has fitted them, wish we had all of spoken to you first, could have saved some cash LOL

 

NO. I panic,park up,and go and have a coffee!.

 

The OP had a soft pedal after a track session mate. Fluid fade, not a soft pedal all the time.

How many times does it have to be said LOL. Even Jamie has told you. Braided lines do nothing significant to control fluid temp.

 

i know what he said mate LOL and wow, even Jamie ! LOL i'll say it to you one more time LOL, i never said the lines would help temps, but they do help pedal feel LOL

 

You mean no one has told you the best technique is to stay out and brake harder and later to cool the brakes.

Sorry just being a bit facetious. But that seems to work here.

 

do you know either Conley or 172RS by any chance LOL

 

Are you sure? Ahem :rolleyes::

 

oh dear, bit out of context but you enjoy yourself LOL

 

Threads like this are why people most people who have tracked Meganes for years and proved the best setup don't bother posting .. Hilarious

 

I thought the original question was in regards to why the brakes are overheating (which is IMO user error) not cooling them when they are all ready hot?

By your logic it will be best to ride the breaks constantly to cool them?

 

i do a few trackdays and am by no means "the stig" i usually get tuition and every instructor has told me to brake late and hard. on my first trackday i dragged the pedal for ages overheating the fluid, that was with RBF 600 and RC6 pads ( and braided lines LOL)Once id got the message i no longer have a problem with overheating, so late and hard works for me.

 

We all know braking hard and late (threshold braking) is best for lap time. However, as I covered now so many times, it is also the technique that will give you max threshold brake temps over time.

 

I've found that braking the way you mention to cool brakes only leaves pad deposits.

 

Snag is your physics doesn't apply to this situation.

That great example of F1, the pinnacle of Motorsport technology, will taper back hard braking to limit critical brake temperatures.

Apply your physics to that scenario.

 

And your technique of coming into the pits would go down a storm with Lewis Hamilton.

 

we are doing trackdays, not F1 ffs, bet you haven't got a car.

 

Of course, and those really easy trackday braking solutions are well worth knowing.

 

Keep up the good work mate lol

 

My comment was nothing to do with physics though, I put , did you learn anything when I went out with you Steve

 

If you knew anything about physics, the equations I posted earlier would show that it does apply to this scenario.
If you can prove me wrong I'd love to hear it.

If I thought you would comprehend I could provide a detailed explanation, however you fail to grasp the basics that I have mentioned earlier.

Don't take this the wrong way as I love a debate, but you've been on this forum for 5 mins and from what I've seen you post on this thread and others is very argumentative bordering on trolling - you don't appear to take any other persons comments on board.

You've been insulting to sunnylunn and told another member you can't take them seriously as there view point differed to yours.

We all like a different view point etc but your coming across as a bit of a nonce

 

It was in reply to the what a boring thread this has turned into (thought I quoted that) not the learn anything bit

 

Just ignoring your desire to apply some Physics for a bit, even your average builder knows if you continually brake a car from 100-40 Mph using max threshold braking, the brake temperatures will be higher than if you do it gently.

I’m sure people actually reading this thread also understand that. What technique you use on circuit is up to driver. Your physics doesn’t take into account repeated and rapid braking cycles.


Get all personal does you no favours either.

 

Every bit of advice I've ever seen for minimising brake fade has always said not to prolong the braking period of the corner more than you need to. You seem to be suggesting to prolong the braking period at a lower pressure and that will reduce the heat, however that goes against all the advice and my own experience with fade/brakes on track.

 

i think you will find he is right and everyone else is wrong LOL

 

The learn anything part was deleted yesterday, never mind mate, doesn't matter

 

im not your average builder, for starters I'm a roofer and far from average lol,

 

Reading all this,is this a car forum,or a script for a soap opera?!.

 

You what pal?! You 'avin a larf?!

 

I wasn't trying to get personal.
I was trying to offer you some advice.

The pdf I linked to earlier in the thread has the physics of all the heating/ cooling cycle info if your interested.

I will try and explain this one last time, this is a hypothetical situation (so an extreme case). Take a long hill with 2 cars, they both should cross at the same time due to the same average speed, so same energy etc etc, one goes down and keeps applying the breaks (threshold breaking) when he hits 60 mph he brakes until 40mph then coasts to 60 brake repeat over and over to the bottom of the hill. (Multiple repeated hard breaking)He will still have breaks at the bottom of the hill.

2nd car gently applies the breaks to maintain a steady 50mph all the way down the hill - most likely no breaks at the bottom as the fluid has boiled/ pads overheated etc.

 

but what if driver's female.....

 

Tell her to get back in the kitchen....

 

I wish i had the courage to say that.

 

Interesting analogy but seriously flawed for the circuit situation unfortunately. Your example firstly assumes the steady state car will exceed critical brake temp. It may not. But much more importantly on a circuit with both cars braking from the same speed, the late and heavy breaker gains a time and distance advantage because he is on the brakes later. On a track the KE rate of expenditure (cycle rate) for the late braking scenario is more rapid. In summary, they do not end up with the same average speeds or end up at the same point on the track at the same time.

Like I have said many times the application here is important. It's not just a simple average speed, steady state answer.