So how much of a premium will people be paying for this 20hp and a trophy badge? Yes..this videos useless,as obviously the megane was never going to match its more powerful rivals for straight line speed. Every other review i have read,or watched etc,says its not the revelation the mk3 was. Will it be as big a success in achieving sales as the mk3??We will see.
From a practicality point of view the fact that the Megane is slower than the Civic might actually be a good thing. I hear that the Meg rides hard but if they had gone a more hardcore route and really try to beat the Civic in lap times, the result might be a pretty much undriveable car in everyday terms. I'm not sure if the buying public is ready for a reality check yet, but only one in a thousand drivers will ever need that one second's worth of extra track performance, while every single one really needs the road manners and civility that a car can offer. With the latest hyper hatches it's much a question of three parties fighting eachother and seeing which will win. It's the press versus manufacturer versus users. Each have their own wants and needs but so far the press has been dictating things, at least for the last 20 years or so. For the fight to end the press will need to understand that a hot hatch with a premium price tag is primarily not a track day car but a road car. Many users will see this anyway and just spend the same money on two cars instead of one: one that is more suited to everyday driving and one that is more suited to trackday duty. Some manufacturers are moving into the right direction (like with the Pug 208 and 308) but they're getting bad press for it. With the 208 press only rates really highly the 208 BPS which is the worse road car of the two 208 GTis. The Megane seems to have taken the right approach as well, focusing more on road driving than track, but is apparently still quite stiff so as to match the rivals on the track. The Civic Type R now that it has real power being turbocharged, is a very impressive machine. But it's impressive in a way which should make one wonder what point there is to try to make such a practical hatchback into a supercar and greatly diminish the good qualities a normal Civic would have. Hot hatches have gotten too hot for their own good and the press doesn't get it. Press people think every car should be a toy and nothing else will do...
I think the Civic is so good BECAUSE it is also a very comfortable useable daily driver too. I saw on Instagram the testing the R, anyone have any more info?
This is very true. Honda have listened to the harsh criticism of customers and press, of the terribly hard ride of the out going model. Resulting in a brand new floor pan, multi link rear suspension,and a totally revised ride. It rides on "20 wheels with 35 profile tyres,and yet now has the best ride and, on road manners of any hot hatch on the market. It really is a remarkable achievement. IF only they had styled it more conservative, they would be selling them as fast as they could make them.
If they styled the Honda more conservative would it be as good. I know it seems lairy and the big wing is a bit marmite but it's been designed like that on purpose to increase stability and generate downforce. The Honda looks wild and the others look very similar/ boring.
Its not the wings that are the problem, even the standard Civic is an ugly ungainly looking thing, especially from behind where it is just a mess of ideas. Its quite strange to see Honda go like this, they used to be ultra conservative in a way which I don't believe put anyone off buying an S2000 or an EP3.
yes..those huge blocks of fake black plastic grilles in the front, and rear bumpers make me cringe. Theres a type S driving around near us..looks even worse. Time and time again though,its winning tests on the road. Hopefully a mid life restyle will be on the cards.
you can visually see how much wider and longer the civic is compared to the Renault. in reality..you would love to own any one of them.
The previous gen Type R looked great, the current one looks awful and it's way too large a car to even be considered a normal hatch anymore. But such is the way of things; for real hot hatch essence one has to look at B-segment cars now, the traditional Golf class (C-segment) cars are so freaking big now they make a W126 S-Class feel compact... Yeah I'm cynical but let's just say a truly small and light hot hatch isn't even made today. No the Abarth 500 isn't it because it's as tall as an S-Class and weighs about 250 kilos more than it should. It's also too bad the current Twingo is really a Smart car underneath. The idea of rear engine and truly compact size had such great promise. But manufacturers these days aren't interested in making quick, small cars and that is such a shame. Yes the new C-segment super hatches are impressive but they're simply too damn big and heavy!
Cars are big for a reason though. Outside of the handful of nerds who obsess over steering wheel and weight, most people want lots of safety, lots of equipment, lots of safety systems and good crash protection. All of these add up to heavier cars and ever increasing size. It's inevitable really. Let's face it, most of us want the nice bits like air con, air bags and a good stereo, so we're as much to blame as anyone.
Money, money and money. Manufacturers cut costs wherever they can so they make their new "safe" and "well equipped" cars heavy, because lighter would be more expensive to make. Sure, the lighter cars would have better cornering ability, better braking performance, better fuel economy and less need for horsepower to achieve the same performance, but hey, since the buyers aren't paying too much attention the companies just continue making heavy cars to make more money. In that respect we are to blame, we don't demand progess, we just kindly buy whatever they produce. To hell with safety and economy for the customer, it's all about money.
That is all true and fundamentally adding a bit more metal doesn't make a car that much more expensive but in our psyche bigger cars with better NVH have much more value. Personally I would live to see a current version of either the Lupo GTI, or RS twingo but such a car doesn't exist. Even stalwart Suzuki gave up and "ruined" the swift recently.
The modem hot hatches are definitely getting too big. The biggest problem is there’s no where to park them. The average shopping parking space just isn’t big enough without risking it getting pranged!
I loved my 08 swift sport.Old school thrills for peanuts. Super rapid down a twisty road.Would stay with my R26, where BHP couldnt come into play.
I had one on loan for a day, really loved its handling. OTOH though its limits were definitely not old school, I found that one could thread it through cross country corners at pretty much whatever speed your brave enough to try. The reviews saying you could thrash the engine to its limits on a B road blast are 100% true, but only because its cornering limits are so ridiculously high (much like our Meganes in that regard). I think they are perhaps a little more fun than my Meg for that reason, very old fashioned thrills in thrashing an engine to within an inch of its life. Sounds crazy but I have been tempted to chop the Meg to get a nearly new old model swift sport.
the reason why they use them as ring cars! Mine was the earlier version..125 HP but lighter than the facelift model. sat on 17" wheels with 195/45/17 tyres,and as you say bravery, is the deciding pace setting factor. As with all short wheelbase cars,as you approach 3 figure speeds,the rear starts moving around,while the R26 doesnt. 5 speed gearbox was a pain,but it was as short and precise as any shift out there. Also super easy to work on,being put together with simple nuts and bolts. The key to its handling is the suspension which was tuned to UK roads. It rides better than a R26. Theres a steep 2 mile hill climb that leads up to my house. In the swift you could go up it flat out with, the traction control just slightly flicking on. Quite a bizarre sensation that you can use every single HP the car has to offer without a hint of a lift. Always had me laughing like a loon behind the wheel. Sadly missed. Some really nice phase 1`s out there with low miles,at next to nothing money.
Where's that figure been pulled from? The tech sheets for the RS say sub 1600kg, and that includes a 75kg driver and all fluids/ a tank of fuel.
maybe AndrewJeffs was thinking it would be 1750kg with him sitting in it....haha wish i weighed 75kg by the way!
https://www.carfolio.com/specifications/models/car/?car=455840 This says 1600..so a bit out yes. add me..1700!
^It's been reported to weigh 1650 kg in some articles too, and the official figures are seldom accurate. They tend to underrate the weight figures of cars these days so they wouldn't look so obese. Much like what they do with fuel consumption figures.
Yep had a couple of runs against type r. Won every time. Not sure what models they are ie fk2 or whatever they classed as but it was the one with 4 exhausts and one with the 3 exhausts. Must say though the 3 exhaust civic seemed quicker than the other model
I've not come across a single type r civic new or old fettled and running power maps that I can't out drag on the straights. They have even come up to me afterwards and commented how planted and fast the meg is.
I had a run against the earlier model Type R in my Trophy from standstill at santa pod (normal Trophy not the Trophy R) and I was quicker to 100. I had Cup 2 tyres on it though at the time which I think helped my launch and minimal wheelspin through the gearchanges. The Mk3's are quick and not to be underestimated. My 275R pulls like a train it's savage.
